Cosmos Safari
The Cosmos Safari podcast co-hosts David Farina and Rob Webb take listeners on a journey to explore the depths of science's current understanding of the cosmos around us. The Universe is closer than you think!
Cosmos Safari
The Evolution of LIVE Telescope Observing - Fraser Cain on the Future of Astronomy Outreach
Join Dave Farina on The Cosmos Safari Podcast for an in-depth conversation with Fraser Cain, founder and publisher of Universe Today, co-host of Astronomy Cast, and the creator of the long-running Virtual Star Party.
In this episode, we explore how live telescope observing has evolved from its early days of community-driven virtual star parties to today’s era of smart telescopes, remote observing, and AI-assisted astronomy content creation. Fraser shares the challenges of running Universe Today in the age of AI, the struggle to keep science communication human-centered, and his vision for the next phase of online observing—where anyone can access telescopes across the globe in real time.
Whether you’re an amateur astronomer, a STEM educator, or a tech enthusiast curious about the future of astronomy outreach, this episode delivers a fascinating look into how technology and passion for the night sky continue to converge.
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ne to today's episode of
0:01
the Cosmos Safari podcast. I'm thrilled
0:03
to introduce our guest, Fraser Kaine.
0:06
Fraser is the founder and publisher of
0:07
Universe Today, a hugely popular online
0:10
resource that's been bringing space and
0:12
astronomy to the world for over two
0:14
decades. He's also the co-host of
0:16
Astronomy Cast podcast and the host of
0:18
the longrunning virtual star party
0:19
series, which started all the way back
0:21
in 2012 from what I can tell. Today
0:24
we're going to dive into the evolution
0:26
of virtual astronomy and how technology
0:28
has changed that game and what the
0:30
future holds uh for bringing the cosmos
0:33
into everybody's living room or on your
0:35
phone in that uh device or whatever we
0:37
end up having in the future.
0:40
[Music]
0:41
Razer, welcome and thanks for joining
0:43
us.
0:43
Thanks for having me.
0:44
It's been a while. It's been since I
0:46
think 2020 since we really last spoke.
0:48
Yep.
0:50
How's it been going? You've been pretty
0:51
busy.
0:52
Oh, yeah. Yeah, I've been very busy. Um,
0:55
I mean, we've had some really dramatic
0:56
changes that have that have impacted
0:58
just the publishing industry. I mean,
The Changing Landscape of Astronomy Media
1:02
the rise of artificial intelligence,
1:04
large language models, and AI has just
1:06
been bananas on on the amount of content
1:10
that's out there, the quality of the
1:12
content, the discourse, uh, how
1:15
publishing works these days, how things
1:18
are monetized.
1:20
uh you know like being a publisher in
1:22
the in this world today is really tricky
1:26
and the sources of revenue are drying up
1:30
very very quickly. We're seeing a lot of
1:31
publishers go out of business and you
1:33
know we were kind of on the same
1:34
trajectory. I would say 6 months ago, we
1:38
were I was sort of figuring out how I
1:40
was going to wrap up Universe Today
1:41
because the trajectory was clearly in
1:45
freefall and you know my advertising
1:47
revenue had dropped by about 90%. Over
1:50
the last 3 years or so and it was just
1:54
like not sustainable like I couldn't do
1:56
this and hire people and continue to do
1:58
the level of reporting that we did. And
2:01
about 6 months ago, I was like, "Okay, I
2:05
sort of was honest with everybody, our
2:06
audience, and just said like, this is
2:08
what we face." And and so I'm going to
2:10
remove all the ads from the website
2:12
because, you know, they don't pay us
2:14
very much anyway, and make a
2:15
dramatically cleaner existence. No ads
2:17
in the podcast, no ads on the
2:19
newsletter. Everything's going to be
2:20
free. Creative Commons 4.0, use it for
2:22
whatever you want, but we need to have
2:25
patrons instead. And so the way we make
2:27
this work is that you you sort of donate
2:31
on a regular basis to produce the
2:33
content that we do. And the the
2:36
community responded perfectly. It was
2:38
amazing. And overnight what was an
2:41
existential threat was now, okay, I can
2:43
work with this, right? This is
2:44
sustainable. I can continue to pay the
2:46
salaries of all the journalists. I can
2:47
pay the salaries of the people that work
2:49
on our videos that produce our podcasts.
2:53
I don't quite draw a salary, but you
2:55
know, that's fine. That's how it works
2:56
as a as the owner of the business um in
2:59
this sort of crisis. And then we sort of
3:02
are out the other side of this now. So,
3:04
so things feel really good and totally
3:06
sustainable. And so now, you know,
3:08
instead of me being having to deal with
3:11
the whims of the publishing industry, of
3:14
Google taking away the clicks and
3:17
replacing it with AI overviews, the
3:21
absolute rise of of endless amounts of
3:23
AI slop, the um increasing
3:28
control by the advertisers,
3:31
you know, social media companies trying
3:34
to turn everything into walled gardens.
3:35
Like there's all of these forces that
3:38
are working against being able to spend
3:42
time and energy and knowledge and
3:44
expertise in producing space in
3:46
astronomy news and shifting into
3:50
whatever is this sort of mass media
3:51
garbage that is being generated.
3:54
We're able to now just rise above it and
3:56
I don't have to think about any of it
3:57
anymore. I just like what do we what is
3:59
every day I just think what is the best
Responsible vs. Reckless Use of AI
4:01
coverage that we can do for our
4:03
audience? how do we get there? And I
4:06
don't really think about anything else,
4:08
which is great.
4:09
Now, that being said, have you been
4:12
using AI in any ways that are beneficial
4:15
to you as kind of like a way of of
4:18
capturing what you do?
4:19
So, yeah, I mean, like I am not an
4:21
anti-AI person. I am an anti- bad use of
4:25
AI person, right? And so, there are
4:27
perfectly responsible ways that you can
4:29
use AI.
4:31
It's and it's fairly nuanced. So, you
4:34
can have the AI help you understand a
4:38
concept or understand research, but you
4:42
have to realize that it's a lying liar
4:44
that lies. And so, you need to to double
4:46
check the things that it's telling you
4:48
to make sure that you're not falling
4:49
into some kind of trap with it
4:50
hallucinating. You can have it
4:53
clean up your grammar, fix your spelling
4:55
mistakes, but don't let it write for you
4:57
because it is a very, very bad writer.
5:00
um you can have it help you create
5:02
software, but don't think that you're
5:04
going to create software that's going to
5:05
be bulletproof and secure and able to
5:08
stand the test of time. You're looking
5:09
for stuff that's throwaway that's going
5:11
to allow you to to quickly, you know,
5:14
pull something together that solves a
5:15
problem that you have right now and then
5:17
you can just dispose of it. Um don't
5:20
have it draw pictures for you because it
5:23
is you know the the
5:26
the intellectual property has been
5:29
yes definitely
5:30
you know has been uh stripmined
5:33
for
5:35
the ability to draw these pictures don't
5:37
make it generate video for you same
5:39
thing right which is that we we are not
5:41
confident on the uh on the intellectual
5:44
property that's been used to train these
5:45
things so so I think that there you know
5:47
we're in this sort of weird time where
5:51
it's not great and has some interesting
5:55
value that you can bring to the table,
5:57
but I think a lot of people are just
5:58
overly relying on it. They're saying,
5:59
"This is a magic tool that does
6:01
everything that we need and now we can
6:02
just let it pump out article after
6:04
article, but it's creating garbage,
6:06
right?" And and I think in the near term
6:09
this is going to negatively impact the
6:12
audience that people and I see this
6:15
already. People go to YouTube and
6:16
they're and they're trying to look for
6:18
for videos to watch about important
6:21
things that are happening right now like
6:22
the comet 3i atlas that is passing
6:24
through the solar system and they are
6:28
finding tons and tons of AI slot videos
6:30
and people that are just making nonsense
6:31
and and then they don't know what's true
6:33
anymore. Right? And we're over here
6:35
going, "Okay, we're, you know,
6:36
everything we do is humanmade. We're,
6:38
you know, we're very carefully trying to
6:40
curate this news, and we just are lost
6:43
in the noise." And so, it's really hard
6:44
for people to know what's good, what's
6:46
bad, and so on. So, yeah, it's a it's a
6:48
pretty tricky time. You know, I don't
6:50
have a problem with people using AI. I
6:51
just have people problem with people
6:53
using AI badly.
6:55
Yep. I'm using it uh mostly to capture
6:59
what I say because I've been doing a lot
7:03
more off-the cuff type of content. So,
7:06
I'm not, you know, for a while I had,
7:09
you know, been typing up a script even
7:11
at sometimes. And I've gotten away from
7:14
that. I mean, I'm I teach during the
7:15
day. I talk for a living. I don't really
7:18
have a problem with y
7:19
just thinking on my feet. And so I've
7:21
I've kind of been freed of the shackles
7:24
of a of a script and a teleprompter
7:26
which has been amazing. Me too. And
7:28
yeah, I I haven't sort of pulled up my
7:30
teleprompter in a long long time that
7:33
everything I do is now just a bunch of
7:35
notes and then I just free form
7:36
write bullet points and things like
7:38
that. And so I've let it kind of read
7:41
and transcribe my videos and then from
7:43
there it's been doing a number of
7:46
things. It's been helping me with
7:47
descriptions. It's been helping me
7:49
determine where are good areas for uh
7:52
chapters in my in my content.
7:54
Yeah, that all Yeah, that's all just
7:56
grunt work that you that you would have
7:58
to do and you wouldn't even have to put
Smart Technology and the Rise of Live Telescope Streams
8:00
a lot of thought into it. So, that all
8:02
sounds perfectly fine to me. Speaking
8:03
about smart technology, um back in 2020
8:07
when we first kind of crossed paths, I
8:10
had joined um I think it was three
8:13
different star parties or or live
8:15
telescope viewing sessions
8:18
and I coming to this conversation today,
8:21
I just kind of wanted to get an
8:23
understanding of where you're at with
8:25
the smart telescope game and how you
8:28
kind of see how this has changed our
8:30
ability to share our universe with, you
8:32
know, everyone and how it has changed uh
8:36
from the person who's trying to run said
8:38
Starwatch uh
8:41
you know to to complicate not to
8:43
complicate but to uh simplify I should
8:46
say the process of actually getting up
8:48
and running because I remember although
8:51
I was on three separate live telescope
8:54
viewing sessions I wasn't very
8:56
productive for you in those sessions
8:58
because I kept having problems with my
9:00
gear
9:01
and so this is a different world that we
9:04
live in now. And
9:05
I'd say it's pretty close still. It's a
9:07
little better, but not much.
9:08
Okay.
9:09
Yeah. Yeah. The, you know, what you're
9:12
talking about are the virtual star
9:13
parties when we were broadcasting live
9:15
views from telescopes out onto the
9:17
internet and people were, you know, we
9:19
were hanging out and chatting about them
9:20
and switching to different pictures and
9:22
show showing them off and taking
9:23
requests and all of that kind of stuff,
9:25
right? And it was wonderful. Like it was
9:27
really resonating with the audience and
9:28
people really enjoyed it. But
9:30
technically it was brutal to try to
9:33
bring these things together. You had the
9:36
individual astronomers who ha you know
9:39
who had better and worse personalities
9:41
in just being able had more better and
9:44
less experience in being able to present
9:47
information to an audience. And then
9:49
they had the challenges that they had to
9:51
deal with the gear which was distracting
9:52
them. So that they were like am I
9:54
talking right now or am I wrestling with
9:56
my gear? And it was a very challenging
9:58
experience to make the whole thing run
The Birth and Struggles of the Virtual Star Party
10:00
very smoothly. And then you had the
10:02
weather variation. So somebody might be
10:04
really good and ready to go and got
10:05
great gear, but they've got bad weather,
10:06
so they can't show up.
10:08
And then it's just a um it's a very
10:11
challenging
10:13
onus on people to have them be able to
10:15
show up and do this work. So, so it was,
10:19
you know, it went great for a couple of
10:20
years and then eventually it just got to
10:23
the point where where I would have 20
10:25
astronomers in the list who would who,
10:28
you know, I had sent the notification
10:30
for them to show up if they could and
10:32
nobody would show up for whatever
10:34
reason. People were busy, gear wasn't
10:36
working, weather was bad, they just
10:37
didn't want to do it, whatever. Which is
10:38
fine. You know, there everybody was
10:40
volunteers including me. So it's not
10:42
like we were, you know, there were any,
10:44
it's not like anybody's job to do this.
10:47
So
10:48
we tried. So we went for about three or
10:51
four years and then we wrapped it up
10:52
just because it was too difficult. And
10:54
then it's funny um my friend Dylan
10:57
O'Donnell uh in Australia tried to do
11:01
the same thing, same model, just let's
11:03
organize some people, let's show their
11:05
telescopes. And he also was like, "Nope,
11:07
I can't do this anymore. This is just
11:09
this too much hurting cats." And then uh
11:11
Nancy Graiano, who was a a producer for
11:14
us, really loved the star parties and
11:16
she was like, "Okay, I'm going to do it.
11:17
I'm going to herd the cats." And we
11:19
tried again and we went for a couple of
11:21
months and then she was like, "Nope, I'm
11:22
out. I can't do it." So we had to wrap
11:24
it up again. And then about
11:29
five years ago,
11:31
um, uh, Oceanside Photo and Telescope
11:34
when it was a thing, the the leader of
11:38
OPT,
11:39
um,
11:41
sort of offered a telescope that I could
11:42
use permanently, like, you know, he or
11:45
when he wasn't using it and then I could
11:48
just sort of remote in and be able to
11:49
actually use the telescope and that
11:51
worked pretty well, but we still had the
11:54
weather issues and so if the weather was
11:55
good, then it was great, and if it
11:56
wasn't, it was. But we ran into all
11:58
kinds of technical issues, and it was
12:00
pretty far off the grid. The Wi-Fi was
12:01
pretty bad, and so it was it was a very
12:03
frustrating experience. And then most
12:06
recently, maybe about a year and a half
12:07
ago, I talked to Starfront, which is a
12:11
new collocation telescope facility out
12:14
of Texas. And they were really excited
12:17
about the idea of of me being able to do
12:19
live streams from their telescopes and
12:21
and be able to um you know, share this
12:24
with the world. And then obviously, you
12:26
know, people would find out about what
12:27
they what they're doing at Starfront.
12:29
And they gave me access to a couple of
The Role of Partnerships and Remote Observing
12:31
great telescopes. One was a Celestron
12:34
first star. No, is that it? First scope.
12:38
First star. The
12:40
uh the one that's the new smart
12:42
telescope.
12:43
Yeah, the their smart telescope. Yeah.
12:45
Yeah. Origins. The origins. That's it.
12:46
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, I had the
12:47
Celestron Origins
12:49
and then they had a planetary scope that
12:51
they were letting me use and both had
12:54
just so many problems. like they were
12:57
amazing telescopes, but Celestron, the
13:00
only way you can control the origins
13:01
telescope is with an app. And so you
13:03
have to like run the app virtually
13:04
inside of a computer and then the app
13:06
tries to obfuscate where the files are
13:08
being stored on the computer. So it's
13:10
really hard to get the images off of the
13:12
computer and display them. Like
13:15
it was it was a technical nightmare to
13:17
be able to try to do this and be able to
13:20
put on a show at the same time. like I
13:22
can either focus on
13:24
working my way through the technical
13:26
challenges to be able to deal with this
13:27
or I can share stuff with people. So,
13:30
and then the goal was to then get more
13:32
more telescopes. But then we just ran
13:34
into the same problem which was trying
13:35
to get people to show up on time and
13:37
have their gear ready and have their
13:38
weather was good and be able to do this.
13:40
So, you know, we're we were kind of
13:42
lurching forward in that path. And so,
13:44
we're on hiatus again. Um, you know,
13:47
there's a new idea that we're working on
13:49
where we might be able to use um, sea
13:52
stars, which are which are really cool
13:54
telescopes. I've got one behind me right
13:58
there. Um, and that people would be able
14:01
to like we could be have an interface
14:04
that's very usable and and and anyone
14:07
can kind of log in and use it and then
14:09
and then we don't have to worry about
14:10
the different gear. we just everybody
14:12
gets a sea star and we all will point at
14:15
different targets and see what we can
14:16
see and have a good time and just chat
14:18
about it. And so that's sort of the the
14:20
most modern
14:23
implementation of the idea, but the sea
14:25
stars are the same thing as the origins,
14:27
which is that they're designed to be
14:29
controlled through a phone or on a
14:30
computer. They're not designed to be
14:32
controlled remotely. And so I've been
14:34
spending the last 6 months or so trying
14:37
to hack together and figure out a way
14:39
that you can control the sea star
14:40
remotely through the internet in a way
14:43
that is a nice reliable easy to use
14:46
experience so that people can can come
14:47
together to use these telescopes and be
14:49
able to to live stream them and and I
14:51
have not solved this problem yet. So we
14:53
are currently on hiatus again while we
14:56
try to figure out and like what all we
14:58
need is a easy telescope that's
The Modern Era: Smart Telescopes and the Quest for Accessible Remote Observing
15:01
accessible from the internet that you
15:03
can let anybody log in and use and they
15:05
can just control the telescope and the
15:07
pipeline is very simple to do and the
15:09
files are deposited in a certain place.
15:12
It's not that complicated when you
15:14
consider how sophisticated all of the
15:16
other parts of the puzzle are. And yet
15:19
here we are um
15:21
13 years ago, 13 years after we started
15:24
doing the virtual star parties. And I
15:27
always kind of feel like I'm back to
15:28
square one. And this is of course, you
15:30
know, because I am using a,
15:34
you know, like there's no budget, right?
15:36
It's not like anyone's giving me money
15:37
to do this kind of thing. I'm just
15:38
trying to figure this out through by any
15:40
means necessary. And so this is where we
15:43
this is where we are now.
15:44
All right. So, so is the sea star that
15:47
you're hoping to use the one behind you
15:49
or are you trying to offload that to a
15:52
different location?
15:52
Yeah. So, this is a thing that I'm
15:54
trying to do with Starfront because
15:55
they've got sea stars in their facility.
15:57
And so, but they're designed to work
15:59
with a phone with a with a phone or a
16:01
computer. They're not designed to be
16:04
easily accessible from a remote through
16:06
the internet in a way that is reliable
16:09
and easy to use and doesn't give you
16:11
sort of too much control over the device
16:12
and so on. like like how do you let a
16:15
person come in control the sea star and
16:17
then move on? So So we're still kind of,
16:20
you know, trying to figure this out.
16:22
We'll figure it out at some point. I I
16:24
did visit their website because I
16:25
noticed that you had been using their
16:27
facilities for this purpose of doing the
16:29
live telescope viewing and it does show
16:31
up on their website as an option. So
16:33
they're they're
16:35
capable of doing it to some degree, but
16:36
is it live streaming component that's
16:38
the most challenging part?
16:40
Yep. Yeah. I I don't know.
16:42
Yeah. Okay.
16:45
So, what com if you had, you know, a
16:48
dream of what this would look like from
16:51
like a a
16:53
software perspective, like what what
16:55
would it be able to do that it's
16:58
currently not doing? Well, so I mean the
The Dream Platform for Astronomy Outreach
17:01
dream is that you take a bunch of people
17:02
who are interested in astronomy and you
17:06
give them a login so they can log into a
17:08
a telescope and the telescope is a very
17:11
easy to use interface that allows them
17:13
to pick targets and then watch the
17:16
images be created in front of them and
17:18
then then they download them and keep
17:19
them.
17:20
That's it. That's it. And and share what
17:23
they're what they're doing.
17:25
Yeah. in a way that can then be pulled
17:27
together into a larger show.
17:29
Right. So, so like I'm using uh I've
17:32
I've used the Dwarf
17:34
3.
17:35
Uh I've I've I've talked to some people
17:38
about the Sea Star, but I haven't ever
17:40
had a chance to work with one my myself
17:42
at this point, but I'm very familiar
17:44
with the ZWOO's interface and how that
17:46
works. Uh I currently have a smart eye,
17:49
which is pretty neat. So, um, the one
17:51
thing that I'm kind of noticing that's
17:53
different about that is that it does
17:55
have the, uh, ASCOM alpaca mode. So, you
17:59
can shift over to doing more of a
18:01
traditional imaging type of thing. So, I
18:04
and and troll it from
18:06
uh, various different
18:08
interfaces. So, that might be an option
18:11
that I'm going to be looking at because
18:13
the reason I asked you about this is
18:15
because I'm a glutton for punishment
18:17
also and have considered, you know,
18:20
starting to do some live observing
18:22
myself.
18:22
So, great.
18:24
Using using my my StreamYard here that
18:26
I'm currently working on uh to make a
18:28
podcast, I could do live streaming. I
Dave's Reflections on Streaming and Smart Scopes
18:31
just I just don't do it very often.
18:33
Yeah. No, but like like I think if it's
18:35
one person with dark skies and the and
18:38
the telescope is nearby,
18:40
then I think then it's a relatively easy
18:43
experience,
18:43
right?
18:44
But if it's if you're trying to pull
18:46
like the point with the star parties is
18:48
we were trying to pull together multiple
18:50
people at the same time to make an
18:53
experience. I just think
18:55
from one person,
18:57
you know, just trying to conceive of a
18:59
way that people could share within these
19:01
platforms like with if it's going to be
19:03
through a phone. Um, you know, it's it's
19:06
one thing to go to like Starfront and
19:08
try to connect to them separately, but
19:10
but if if each person has their, you
19:13
know, their telescope with them, uh, it
19:16
would be nice if some of these software
19:18
that are running these devices would
19:20
have an integrated ability to to kind of
19:23
join together and, you know, a room
19:26
a room that you could join, you know.
19:28
Yeah. Yeah. They just don't like like I
19:29
think they just don't it doesn't occur
19:31
to them the comp like it doesn't occur
19:33
to to ZWO that makes the sea star that
19:36
you would want to set up your telescope
19:38
and control it remotely
19:40
like it just it just doesn't even cross
19:42
their radar.
19:44
Sure.
19:44
Right. when obviously obviously you'd
19:46
want to take your sea star, you'd want
19:48
to put it into under really dark skies,
19:49
make it really robust that you can
19:51
control it and then you you go back home
19:53
and then you control your telescope
19:56
right from your your living room or
19:58
whatever.
19:58
Over the years that you've been doing
20:00
this, what
20:03
I mean you've started and stopped this
20:06
enough times. I think you have a a
20:08
passion for it. So, what has been the
20:10
response that you get from the audience
20:12
that like people that aren't actually
20:14
doing
Fraser’s Advice to Educators and Amateur Astronomers
20:15
Oh, they love it work.
20:16
Yeah, they love it. They people think
20:18
it's one of the coolest things they've
20:19
ever seen.
20:20
Yeah. I mean, they don't have access to
20:22
this type of stuff and we do. So, it's
20:23
like that's that's why I like to share
20:25
that kind of stuff is
20:26
Yeah. totally. Yeah. People think it's
20:28
phenomenal. They love it.
20:30
And and when you're doing one of these
20:32
live telescope observing sessions, um
20:35
where do you generally kind of host it?
20:37
Do you host it all over the place or
20:39
you're mostly on YouTube or how do you
20:40
generally
20:41
I just Yeah, I host it on YouTube.
20:43
Yeah. And do do you announce when you do
20:46
these types of things because you're
20:48
talking about
20:48
Yeah. I mean, like that's that's always
20:49
the challenge, right? Which is
20:51
you want to announce in advance that
20:53
you're going to do a thing that's
20:55
dependent on weather and gear, but
20:57
that's what we do. And then we just we
20:59
say, "Nope, it's not it's not happening.
21:00
Didn't work."
21:02
I think it'd be really cool, you know.
21:03
Um, so Sky Safari is like what's running
21:07
in the background for uh the smart eye
21:11
and you know there's a relatively large
21:13
number of people who use that and it
21:15
would be really cool if we had as I said
21:18
kind of a room that you could go to even
21:21
within a platform you know it does kind
21:23
of walled garden a little bit um where
21:27
this is able to be interacted with but
21:29
if you could have one place where you
21:31
know whether it's ZWO sea or or the
21:34
Smart Eye or the Dwarf Lab. Um, but just
21:37
have within that platform the ability to
21:38
to collaborate with that similar device
21:41
and you know maybe even from there then
21:43
it hosts to like YouTube or something
21:44
like that.
21:46
Then at least you can the collaborative
21:47
part is is is kind of out of the way and
21:50
the ability to share it still to those
21:52
other platforms would be would be pretty
21:54
neat.
21:55
Totally. Uh
21:57
yeah. Yeah. Like it's just I think
22:00
I mean nobody has so far made an
22:04
effortless solution for this,
22:07
right? So you go the one I've sort of
22:08
imagine different routes. You can um you
22:12
know there's an API that lets you
22:13
connect to a sea star and I've tried
22:15
hacking the API to get it to do what I
22:17
need and it's it's been kind of I've
22:19
been mildly successful but but it wasn't
22:21
robust and it wasn't working the way
22:22
that I wanted to. You could go down the
22:24
ASCOM route and and have your own
22:28
completely,
22:29
you know, you control the camera, the
The Future of Astronomy Collaboration
22:31
the mount and the all of the various
22:34
components of a telescope. And then you
22:36
figure out a way to get all that piped
22:37
into a custom interface that allows you
22:39
to control it in a way that's very
22:40
simple and easy to use and integrates
22:42
with a tool that lets you find objects
22:45
in the sky. Like there's there's
22:47
different ways this could be done, but
22:49
none of them are are easy to do in my
22:52
spare time. Exactly.
22:53
With my current level of knowledge with
22:55
no budget,
22:56
right?
22:57
Yeah.
22:57
Right.
22:58
So, so you know, I pick away at it and
23:00
and wait for the right, you know, I'm
23:02
always evaluating the technologies that
23:04
are out there and I'm waiting for the
23:05
right one, the best one. If a software
23:07
company wants to take this on,
23:09
like, you know, as you say, Skyari,
23:11
whatever, right? And be able to that
23:13
have the interface of the sky be the way
23:16
that you navigate the things you want to
23:18
look at. That would be amazing, right? M
23:21
and then the telescope follows
23:24
what the interface to the um to the
23:28
thing is showing you, right?
23:30
You can do all sorts of stuff with that.
23:31
You know, you could have people kind of
23:33
request in, you know, certain objects
23:35
and like vote on what they want to see
23:37
next and
23:38
Yeah. Or Yeah. Or even just as a way to
23:39
control your own sea star or your own
23:42
smart telescope, right? That you you
23:44
have the app, you you pick but but like
23:47
you need to have the thing be available
23:48
on the computer. things need to be able
23:50
to like how do you if you're using it on
23:51
an app, how do you get the view of the
23:54
app?
23:55
So, the way it's currently
23:56
streaming out to OBS,
23:58
the way it's currently working is that
23:59
you can you can interface with it uh the
Behind the Scenes of Universe Today
24:03
C the smart eye through your browser on
24:06
any device.
24:07
So, that's kind of a different take on
24:10
it.
24:11
Currently, you need to be on the same
24:13
network. that see
24:14
uh but that's that's where you know it
24:17
would become more challenging but
24:20
you know there's there are some
24:22
workarounds there but it's a little
24:23
easier to do a work on with another
24:25
computer than it is a phone or tablet.
24:28
So
24:29
yeah, but it's it's like the same Yeah,
24:31
it's the same issue, right? which is
24:33
that you need to um you need to be able
24:36
to have the computer be remote
24:40
and it needs to be very easy to use and
24:43
then you need to be able to um to be
24:46
able to have the control of the thing be
24:49
be you so that you can broadcast it with
24:52
something like uh OBS or Streamlab or
24:56
whatever, right? that there's like
24:58
things that need to be all functioning.
25:00
And you know, a lot of these companies,
25:04
it's it's just like literally never
25:05
occurred to them
25:06
that you would want a more robust way of
25:09
controlling the telescope than your
25:11
iPhone.
25:12
Sure.
25:13
It's just like, wait, what? You want to
25:15
do what? You don't want You want to sit
25:17
with a computer that has all of the
25:19
processing power and all this capability
25:21
and has this these hard drives and has
25:22
this high-speed connection to the
25:24
internet and this ability to connect
25:25
various external devices into it. You
25:27
want to do that as opposed to be
25:29
completely limited by what's possible
25:31
with a phone.
25:32
Yeah.
25:33
Yeah.
25:33
So,
25:35
you know, as I start to kind of dive in
25:37
into this and dip my toe into the world
25:39
that you've been doing for a number of
25:41
years, uh I would really love to have
25:43
you on at some point if you're
25:45
interested in doing um you know,
25:47
something with me. Uh this is
25:51
a dream that I've had now for a number
25:52
of years of of bringing this kind of
25:54
stuff back because as I said we we
25:57
worked you know I was trying to help you
25:59
with the star parties back in 2020 and
Final Thoughts & Farewell
26:02
it it it kind of failed on me and I'm
26:04
not okay with that.
26:05
Yeah. I mean you experience firsthand
26:08
what it's like to have the technical
26:09
failure of your gear.
26:11
Right. So then the next level is that
26:14
you're trying to manage a show where
26:17
various people are experiencing
26:18
technical failures of their gear and
26:21
trying to make it a consistent
26:22
experience for people. It's brutal. It's
26:24
brutally tough.
26:25
It is brutal. It's it's enough when
26:27
you're, you know, out under the stars
26:29
and you are having technical
26:31
difficulties and you're frustrated
26:32
because you can't get something to work.
26:34
But it's another thing to be live
26:35
streaming it through the internet for
26:37
everybody to see you fail.
26:38
How's it going? Have you figured that
26:39
out yet? No. Still having technical
26:40
issues. Okay, we'll come back to you
26:42
later.
26:42
Exactly. Exactly.
26:44
So, so it's just like for me it just
26:47
never felt good enough. Never felt
26:50
acceptable and and wasn't worth sort of
26:55
expending the energy in this place where
26:58
I couldn't think of an easy way to get
26:59
it. Not even easy way. I couldn't think
27:01
of a way to get get it to what I knew it
27:04
needed to be. And it's just like, well,
27:06
you know, I've got other priorities. So,
27:07
for now, I'll let that sit and I'll come
27:10
back to that idea when I feel like the
27:12
technology is ready to go. I mean, I
27:14
think like like the idea is still sound.
27:16
I feel like it's the best idea I've ever
27:17
had, right? That that it's this
27:20
wonderful place where you can take
27:22
people who are excited about the night
27:23
sky and you can connect them with actual
27:26
telescopes so they can learn just how
27:28
this technology works to bring us these
27:30
pictures that everybody is so fascinated
27:32
and are excited about. But we're not at
27:36
the place where it's still a dependable
27:40
and reliable enough experience that it's
27:43
it's worth trying to put on a regular
27:45
show. It's fine for, you know, if you
27:48
have your own telescope and you want to
27:49
do some streaming and people are can
27:50
accept the highs and lows of that,
27:52
that's fine. But but for me the you know
27:56
I think we're still a few more
27:57
technological leaps to get to the point
27:59
where this really is this truly
28:01
accessible
28:03
robust uh process but we'll get there I
28:06
think. Well uh as I said I'd really love
28:09
to have you on again some point once we
28:12
you know hopefully have some of this
28:13
technology in place where we can maybe
28:16
do some of these live streamed uh
28:18
telescope observations and
28:20
Awesome. and uh when I do, I'll I'll
28:23
certainly be in touch.
28:24
I I look forward to your struggles.
28:26
All right. Thank you so much for coming
28:28
on. All right. Take care.
28:29
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